Members of the Trust board met with representatives from the club in a meeting last Thursday 25th January 2024 to put forward questions that we the Trust had and questions that members had sent to us.
Minutes of meeting held Thursday 25th January 2024
Present: Simon Gauge, Richard Knight, Tony Pockney, Murray Knight, George Delves, Ryan Bradley, Ian Goodwin, Charlie Stansfield, Scott Goulding, Bob Morrisey, Dave Earnshaw, George Brigham
The format of these minutes will differ from previous meetings for a variety of reasons.
As Simon Gauge and George Delves were required to attend the National League AGM earlier in the day, the Trust had forwarded questions received from members the day before the meeting in order to give time for them to be considered and replied to.
The club found time to respond with written answers on Wednesday evening and they are included later in these minutes.
The club also requested that they lead with a crucial agenda in relation to the key topic of club finances and the search for investment, to which we readily agreed.
As we are all aware, the club continues to trade as a direct result of on-going financial support from Simon Gauge and Richard Knight. The Trust expressed collective thanks and gratitude for this generosity.
Simon was keen to explore how the Trust, as the largest shareholder in the club, could bring financial support to the table. It was agreed that the Trust, as per every other shareholder, was a minority shareholder and that the problems of the limited company were the problems faced by each and every shareholder. Nevertheless, the Trust outlined a number of avenues being followed for short, medium and long-term revenue generation and attracting investment.
- Squad builder had already raised c. £10k and the Facebook group that initially started up as an auction site was planning a series of fund-raising events to be hosted at the Ratcliffe and a one-off in the Empire (the Empire has now added a donate button when payments are made by card, to go to the SB fund). The Facebook group will be hosting a table next to the Trust desk in the Dale bar at the next home game
- Small quantity share purchases – it was agreed to issue a request for expressions of interest to purchase a minimum quantity of shares at £2.35 each, and if we can reach 200 such expressions then the club would agree to sell in such quantities up until 1st We did discuss that a typical Rochdale fan would not expect a financial return on any share purchase, and we should also point out that the value of any such investment can reduce.
- Investigating forming a consortium of local businesses in order to invest/acquire the club. The Community Owned Asset model as used by FCUM was cited and efforts that day had been made to access a database of local businesses. The Trust has already compiled a list of local businesses of sufficient size that would warrant such contact. There is also a meeting with Invest in Rochdale planned for Tuesday 30th We had also spoken with Hartlepool’s Supporters Trust in order to establish how they had formed a recent consortium that has made 2 so far unsuccessful offers to buy out their owner
- Contact has been made with a high net worth exiled Rochdalian and we are awaiting a response. Another individual has also been identified and contact details are being sought
- Contact with local and parliamentary politicians has been initiated
- Community ownership fund acquisition of the pitch – although our expression of interest had been accepted, the business plan put forward had not. Further investigation of the requirements highlighted the need for a substantial business plan to be put forward and consequently needs some serious thought. There is no one on the Trust board with the necessary skillset to devise such a plan on their own so external, and probably professional, help is required. The Trust will investigate any potential help and associated costs
For further information on this process, please go to the link:
Funding will end in March 2025, and there will be a number of windows of opportunity to submit applications in the meantime
From the club’s perspective, a new sales pitch has been put together and is attracting interest from a number of parties.
Richard Knight is leading the drive to develop an Executive Club from within the local business community. He will share the brochure with the Trust for the Trust to help generate interest in this scheme
Questions from members:
It was agreed that the Trust Club Board Director will, in future, answer questions on recurring themes, which adds some value to the actual position held. In the meantime, please see some very detailed responses to a good number of questions sent into the Trust ahead of this meeting:
Shares
➢ Will supporters be able to buy 25 shares as proposed by the Trust?
See above
➢ How many of the 50,000 new shares made available to fans have been sold since the announcement was made? (I am keen to understand if the fans have purchased enough to make a difference to our financial predicament.) And then a supplementary depending on whether a decent number have been sold…..”How long will that additional capital investment last”
8665 as of Monday 22/01/24, providing an immediate injection of circa £20k.
➢ I see that the squad builder/fighting fund has been launched. I intend to makecontributions, commencing when I get paid at the start of February. There is a question to which I would like an answer before I make a decision. Is the board willing to allocate shares to the Trust in exchange for the financial contribution to be made for the squad builder? The answer to this question will inform me when I choose which fund to pay into.
No – unfortunately, squad builder funds must sit outside of anything to do with shareholdings in the club. All available shares need to be sold to meet the clubs business plan as submitted to The National League at the start of this season. Squad builder funds need to be over and above the projected income already baked into the business plan from share sales, otherwise the playing budget cannot be altered.
(ii) Finances
➢ Without investment being secured, are there any immediate concerns for the future of the club?
Yes – any improvements will be communicated in order to relieve everyone of the anguish we all face
➢ If there are any immediate concerns, where would the club say supporters need to concentrate their fundraising?
Unsure as to what this question means? Could additional context be provided please?
➢ At the fans forum last year, you said that the electricity costs for the club had more than doubled to circa £200k pa and that you had taken the decision to lock into that higher tariff for 2 years. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but business electricity tariffs for the next 12 and 24 months are almost back to where they were pre Ukrainian war. Has the club renegotiated their tariff or paid an exit fee to be able to take advantage of the new pricing? If there are savings of circa £100k pa to be made here it is worth putting effort into that. PS – The owner of Forest Green Rovers is the founder of Ecotricity – has the club approached him to see if they will help football clubs like ours get a good deal.
Procurement work is underway. Due to commercial sensitivities, there is only a limited amount of information that can be shared. Ecotricity aren’t particularly active within the football industry (outside of FGR) to the best of our knowledge.
➢ If £500k additional revenue per annum is the difference between survival and struggling (I won’t say extinction) what are the plans to drive that extra revenue?
How can we use the stadium more? What ideas are there to try and encourage fans to part with another £10 per month for example, or to build on the Boxing Day promotion to get say 500 of those attendees to buy-in to the rest of the season. It was noticeable that we were one of only a handful of clubs in the National League that didn’t offer half season tickets in December or early January. If there is no capacity to do more, is this where volunteers from the fanbase with “commercial experience” could help?
Firstly, it should be noted that generating an additional £500k over and above existing revenues from ‘non-football’ activity will be extremely challenging. There may be some one-offs that help, but robust, reliable, and repeatable revenue is needed, and commercial activities that tick those boxes for the amounts required are few and far between.
In terms of stadium usage, event-based ideas such as concerts on the pitch have been set up, however there was significant resistance from local residents, which resulted in local councillors campaigning to stop these types of events from occurring. There is still an aspiration to re-visit. We are stepping into the ‘sportsman’s dinner’ type events, however it remains to be seen what these will actually generate. There have been some successes such as electric charging points, NHS facility partnership, and our agreement with Realise Training that sees Bus Drivers frequently being trained on an area of the car park, but none of these are additional revenue based on figures quoted at various stages this season. As previously communicated, there are some bigger ideas that have been investigated (and in some cases, fully planned), including but not limited to:
> Residential construction on the footprint.
> Hotel construction on the footprint.
> Retail units on the footprint.
> Additional office space on the footprint.
> Commercial gym on the footprint.
> Renovation / refurbishment of existing areas to be able to accommodate Asian weddings.
> Renovation / refurbishment of existing kitchens to be able to accommodate a dark kitchen’ for takeaway services.
> Construction of Community Hub at South Heywood, including 2x full size 3G pitches which would each yield a six-figure income annually, as well as removing the expenditure of renting first team and Academy training facilities.
> Hosting of non RAFC football activity on the pitch, PL2 for example.
> Solar panel installation on stadium roofs.
All of the above require significant initial capital outlay, which unfortunately, we do not have access to at present.
In relation to the Boxing Day fixture, all individuals who were first time visitors were contacted after the game with a survey link to feedback on their experience. Subsequently, all who had replied to the survey were contacted prior to the Wealdstone home fixture with the opportunity to purchase discounted tickets for that fixture. Work remains ongoing in that area. In relation to a half season ticket, we do have this ready to go, but due to the Wealdstone promotion, we were waiting to get that game out of the way first as to not have two campaigns running simultaneously. This will launch prior to the Dagenham & Redbridge home game, but it should be caveated with the fact that our research across comparable clubs indicate very little take up from offers of this nature typically. In relation to volunteers from the fanbase with commercial experience, we would welcome help, and remain open to speaking to anyone at any time.
➢ Is there any scope in the budget for the rest of the season to strengthen the squad in key positions to give the manager some options when players are injured? Or is the squad builder initiative the only realistic route here?
The situation is always fluid. As it stands today, there is only limited scope to make additions, and these must come in extremely cheaply, whether on a loan or a permanent basis. The situation can change drastically at any time via factors such as a departure, squad builder, or other investment. The lack of a transfer window work heavily in our favour here.
(iii) Volunteer Army
➢ What have been the positive outcomes achieved since the Volunteer Army meeting in October (with specific reference to the proposed routes forward in the report from the meeting)?
1) Dale Directory – no responses whatsoever from initial meeting, follow up website content, or social media posts.
2) Matchday – no responses whatsoever from initial meeting, follow up website content, or social media posts.
3) One Off Projects – some response to calls for assistance on areas such as Christmas Draw, Boxing Day Ticket Promotion, Display Cabinet renovation, etc.
4) Recurring Projects – Reasonable response in some cases, but as is the nature with volunteering, this can be quite transient. Fanbase contribution has been limited, though. For example, we had a recent graduate volunteering with us for one day per week in an administrative role, however after a couple of months he secured permanent employment elsewhere, and we have been unable to replace with anyone of a similar calibre.
Our partnership with UCFB has been enhanced, and we have a small pool of current students who are undertaking a range of tasks.
Redwood School continue to be an excellent partner, and have extended their duties recently to include cleaning and preparation of Academy kit, for example.
Staff from the Community Trust continue to fill many valuable matchday roles at no cost to the club.
➢ What future plans do the club have in place to utilise the myriad of different skills across the fanbase to ensure all possible revenue streams are maximised?
We remain open to speaking to anyone and everyone. We have appealed to the fanbase on several occasions, however response rate so far has been very low. We will keep trying. On a couple of occasions, prospective volunteers have met with the club to share their ideas, but do not have the capacity to execute their ideas personally. Ideas are well received, but we need volunteers to actually undertake them.
(iv) Fan engagement
➢ Will the club confirm they are aware of and can commit to ensuring previously agreed fan engagement meetings take place as scheduled?
All have taken place so far as scheduled, other than a kit and merchandise focus group that was originally scheduled for 30/11/23. It was deemed necessary to postpone, given events at that time. We would hope that there is sufficient support from the fanbase, as last year this event attracted a low number, for reasons we have never established
➢ We asked the home supporters with season tickets in the Pearl Street to move to free up the end block for away fans in order to keep stewarding costs down. We have done this only a couple of times this season which feels like this change was somewhat disrespectful to the home fans impacted. Why hasn’t this option been used more frequently – or has the club found that it didn’t save money after all?
This is largely due to how fixtures have fallen, as many clubs with more sizable away followings were scheduled in the first half of the season. Out of the remaining nine home fixtures, we expect to only open three stands for at least seven of these. This closure saves a four-figure sum per game on stewarding.
➢ Is the club happy with the current catering partners and are there any plans to update the offering to appeal to more modern tastes? Pies and Nescafe instant coffee are so 1970s. I know it is hard to offer a wider variety in the short 10-15 interval – but trying fresh soup, bowls of chilli, better quality coffee (or the Kenco product from around 8 seasons ago was better than anything we have offered since)- anything to encourage a few hundred more to dip into their wallets.
Feedback from supporters has largely been positive, and there are no plans to changes partners ahead of 24/25 as it stands. We are happy to pass on any individual requests to Scratch for consideration. It should be remembered that only a relatively small percentage of revenue from kiosks flows back to the club.
(v) Academy
➢ The fans are keen to understand whether we plan to continue with the academy into the 24/25 season, especially if we don’t return to the football league in summer? Even if a final decision can’t be made right now, can you give a view on whether you are keen to keep it going?
The timeline as per EFL rules on operating an Academy under the Elite Player Performance Plan (EPPP) outside of the league are below. Youth development is integral to the club. The vast majority of potential investors have demonstrated a strong desire to run the Academy for as long as possible. As stated below, no non-member club of the PL or EFL can run an Academy under EPPP if they have been in The National League for more than two seasons. As such, Oldham Athletic for example will have to close their Academy this summer if they are not promoted this season.
There are too many moving parts to communicate a final position for 24/25 at this stage. It should however be noted that current/recent National League members clubs such as Wrexham, Notts County, Chesterfield, etc, have all run excellent youth development programmes that sat outside of the Academy system. First season after relegation – Clubs will receive 100% of Youth Development funding, and can continue to operate at whichever category they wish (RAFC currently CAT 3).
CAT 1: (u9-u21)
Grant Fund: £1,210,000
Minimum Club Contribution: £2,640,000
Total Required Expenditure: £3,850,000
CAT 2: (u9-u21)
Grant Fund: £804,000
Minimum Club Contribution: £720,000
Total Required Expenditure: £1,524,000
CAT 3: (u9-u18)
Grant Fund: £499,000
Minimum Club Contribution: £154,000
Total Required Expenditure: £653,000
CAT 4: (u17-u18)
Grant Fund: £160,000
Minimum Club Contribution: £62,000
Total Required Expenditure: £222,000
Second season after relegation – Clubs will receive 50% of Youth Development funding, and can continue to operate at whichever category they wish, if they are able to self-finance the remaining 50% of grant funding that has been withdrawn, plus the minimum club contribution. Third season after relegation – No club can operate an Academy within the EPPP framework.
(vi) Community Ownership Fund
➢ As the main aim of the Community Asset Fund bid is to safeguard the ground for the benefit of the community by the Trust purchasing the pitch, will the club still look into the options available regarding selling the pitch to the Trust should the bid not be successful?
There was more than one aim of the bid. Safeguarding the ground is obviously extremely important, however the projected cash injection (circa £1,000,000) from a successful bid would have helped the club enormously during a period where cash was/is in short supply. The club is happy to listen to any suggestions from the Trust that may generate a cash injection in the region of the above.(Also referenced in the minutes of the meeting above)
(vii) Boardroom
➢ Has a suitably qualified Director been identified for co-opting onto the board for the minimum number of 7 Directors as required by the articles to be achieved, and if so, when will this appointment happen?
Nothing to report in this area as yet. The aspiration remains to return to that minimum number soon.
➢ There is a long-standing tradition to offer retiring Directors an honorary position as Life Vice-President, in recognition of the service (and funds) they have provided to the club. Does the club think it might be appropriate to offer this honorary role to: Chris Dunphy – who served the board for 32 years, including 10 as Chairman, during the most successful period of the club’s history, when we were promoted on two occasions. Bill Goodwin – who was another long serving Director and played an instrumental part in delivering stadium ownership back into the hands of RAFC. Jamie Sarsfield – who stood up (with the other current board members) financially to help fight off the hostile takeover and has contributed to the running of our very successful academy.
We do acknowledge the service as referenced, but no discussions of this nature have taken place. Such discussions may potentially take place in the medium term when the urgency of the current situation has passed.